Is it still necessary?
Perhaps one of the most controversial issues in employment, even education, has been Affirmative Action. The question that we will discuss this week is: “Is Affirmative Action still needed?”
32 Responses to “Is it still necessary?”
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I do not believe affirmative action is still necessary. I do not believe minorirites should receive extra spots in a university for the simple fact they are not white. I believe that if you work hard, no matter your backgroud, you can succeed. I think that goes the same for employment oppertunities. I think it should always go to the most qualified candidate, no matter their race, gender, age, etc.
I agree Andrea. Success is no longer just limited to a certain demographic of people. Especially in the United States, where their are so many avenues and opportunities to better oneself, the sky is truly the limit.
I really appreciate your enthusiasm, your experiences, and your beliefs in the American dream. While I equally admire these things, I would suggest that the facts are often not as supportive as our optimism. http://her.hepg.org/content/m14947g30k1x5781/
I absolutely agree. Race should not be a determining factor when being selected for college or a job. Employer’s will select the most qualified candidate for a position regardless of any distinguishing trait.
I agree with your comments and do not feel that affirmative action is still necessary, but rather see it often times as reverse discrimination. We teach our children that if they work hard and believe in themselves they can do just about anything and affirmative action can take that away from them by taking opportunities away becasue they are not of a certain minority.
I struggle with this topic. It’s hard for me to believe that affirmative action was ever necessary as I agree with Andrea that the most qualified person should receive the job. Life should be more fair. If you work hard enough, you get the position. But, I am torn because I have seen the effectiveness in classrooms and a previous job of bringing together a variety of different people from different backgrounds and allowing for the creative processes to not be hindered by narrow-minded views of a certain class of people, whether that be based on race, sex, religion, etc. With that said though, I work for a firm whose vice-president is a female in what used to be a male-dominated industry. Based on that and other items, I think we are very close to reaching the intended goals of affirmative action and can begin to progress it out. With that in mind, I think companies should recruit the best possible talent and upon obtaining that talent, create and deploy teams from its current employment base that are diversified to manage projects and tasks for the company. Use diversity to your advantage, but don’t fill your open position based upon it.
Hi Mason – I completely agree. I think we have come along way with affirmative action. I like your stance on using diversity to your advantage but not let it lead your hiring process. I have always believed in the best qualified person getting the position.
Well said Mason, I appreciate your viiewponts. The challenge is obtaining diversity without the use of affirmative action and still have the job and college application be fair and unbiased. While I do not not how to achieve that I think discussion is the first step.
These are great comments, and well stated. Although there are many that still need to comment, let me pose another question: If a child is raised in a two parent home, middle-income, with access to private schools (both primary and secondary), does that child have any better chance in life than say, a child raised by a single-parent, or foster care, that spends most of their life in poverty, unstable housing, and maybe has the responsibility of raising her siblings? Do both of these children have “equal opportunity?”
I believe that they do have equal opportunity. Financially, one my have more than the other, but living in poverty also means that the child has access to government programs that can help him/her achieve goals. When it comes to college, the person in poverty can have almost a free college education. They may live in two different areas, but they both can live similar lifestyles as adults.
What it comes down to is, what their parents were willing to teach them temporally, sensibly, and emotionally.
I agree that there are mechinicisims to which someone who is considered poor, and wouldn’t necessarily have all of the same oppurtunity as a middle class kid. It’s up to the individual to rise above their current sitiuation.
I agree with you Vito and one quote from Henry Ford that comes to mind throughout this discussion is “Whether you think you can, or you think you can’t -you’re right.” Fortunately, we can think this way in today’s world and this is what the laws have established to bring for us all.
I feel that this falls into the nature vs. nurture debate as well. I feel that children that come from less sometimes have a stronger drive to rise above the poverty they were in a child, however, it is obvious that that is not always the case. I feel that there are different degrees of knowledge and success and that those topics are severly subjective. I see success as rising above a given cirucumstance and creating a better future for oneself through whatever resources one has available. We are fortunate that we live in a country that provides public primary education to children. I am of the belief that regardless of the degree opportunities should be given to those that work the hardest to obtain them.
No, I don’t believe the child with two parents and access to private schools has a better chance in life then a child in poverty. Like Vito said the child in poverty can basically have everything handed to them. The government will pay for food at home, food at school, money for living and that continues all the way through paying for a college education. If that child applies itself and uses the gifts from the government then it could have the same opportunities as the child with two parents. I agree with July also, that the child in poverty may actually do better because they have learned how to fight through life and obtain what they want with very little.
The biggest thing would depend on what kind of impact the parent (or parents) have on the child. If a child has two parents that set a good example, they will have a leg up on their peers that might come from broken or dysfunctional homes. A person’s class and poverty level absolutely create a level of inequality because of the examples they set for them. They are having to break a cycle rather than to just follow by example.
While alot of comments indicate that it is up to the parents and the child to work hard and they can stil achieve the same things in life, your comment really touched on the inequality side of things. This is true, factors such as class and poverty do create a cycle that needs to be broken. We see this all the time in the welfare system. Many children from families on welfare may be able to go to college free but will never go because that is not the example that was set before them. There are certain inequalities between class levels but those can be of advantage or disadvantage. The child who grows up poor can really push themself to rise out of that situation as an adult, and the child who has everything handed to them may never learn the work ethic needed to be successful on their own. I think in the end ti comes down to how they were raised and the influential forces around them.
Again- this is tough. I went to a private school on a scholarship from my church, was raised in a two-parent home with a middle income salary range combined, and yet received no financial aid to help me pursue college. I had to work for it as my parents raised me to work for everything I ever received. All the while, I saw people who came from “lower income” families obtain free college and ended up becoming party animals and somewhat not valuing the gift they had been given because they hadn’t worked for it. When I have seen this, its hard not be in disagreement with a system that its in place that tried to create a “fair” environment with “equal opportunity.” Its a waste of resources. I feel your question above presents a non-equal situation, but I feel another question has to be asked- is life supposed to be fair? I don’t necessarily think it is and God uses different situations for different purposes….
Both of these children do have “equal opportunity”. In the sense, that they are both given the same protection under the various laws supporting equal employment opportunity. It should all come down to who is the best candidate for the given position. At least this is the goal for the many laws made to support Equal Employment Opportunity.
Now, as far as if they will both are given the same opportunities throughout life is a very broad question with numerous possibilities. In doing a bit of outside reading about this topic unfortunately research shows that children who are raised in a single parent household/ foster care may not be as successful to the child raised in a two parent home. I would personally believe that the many life influences that each child may go through such as alert and encouraging parents, enhancing and sane environments; and or even the resilient goal of proving that he or she is not the same as their categorized race or gender.
It’s encouraging to see that the majority of our class members believe that these laws are no longer necessary. I believe that although we may not feel that they are there are parts of the nation that may still be a bit more narrow minded that the rest which is why I believe that these laws are still necessary.
I do not believe affirmative actions is still necessary. It may have served its purpose for a time, but it should have been removed long ago. Laws on human rights, discrimination, and equality has taken its place. The United States has embraced itself as country of many countries. The only minority now is the lowest number of population of a certain race and culture.
Everyone has an opportunity to succeed in our great country. The country gives free education to those who deserve it or does not deserve it. No one is left out. People choose how they want to live and how they want to succeed. No one holds anyone back but only themselves.
Therefore, no one should have the right to take a position that they did not earn.
The concept of affirmative action I feel creates a separate set of standards for the people whom they are trying to create equality. Unfortunately however, I feel that concepts such as affirmative action were put in place because of a small group of people that allowed their personal beliefs to cloud their ethical judgment.
I am a first generation American that comes from a low income family. Because my parents worked on average 13 hours per day, from a young age, my sister and I were forced to raise ourselves. My parents had a certain expectation for our academic success and we were punished when we did not meet those expectations. Even after our family structure deteriorated when I was 18 years old, through my own hard work and determination I was able to put a roof over my head, food on my table and complete my education and build a strong career.
The Unitied States certainly has a bounty of opportunities out there for those that are willing to work and therefore, I do not believe that people are left at a disadvantage because they come from less. A person makes their own destiny regardless of the circumstance that is given to them. I feel that affirmative action creates a society in which there is a sense of entitlement and not of true success. At a time when people of different genders, ethnicities and ages have found success in all avenues of business, I feel that affirmative action only creates a negative sense of competition.
Agreed. And I feel we have our answer for if affirmative action is still necessary if an Asian woman in a very conservative region of our country with traditional values and beliefs feels that it is not necessary.
Touché July! In that we do make our own destiny regardless of our circumstances. It’s unfortunate though that in some cases it has created this sense of “entitlement/ competition”. I do think that parents examples of hard work and sense of expectations helps. The one thing I do not agree with being align in the use of Affirmative Action is the analysis of finding underutilization and having to fill positions of the given minority if this underutilization is present. I think that this would cause the sense that you described.
Affirmative action was first implemented by JFK to create a level playing field for sects of society that had been suppressed for numerous decades. The original goals and intentions of the program were to speed up the integration of minorities, not only in the work place, but within education as well, to create a balanced representation of all classes, ethnicities, religions, etc. Although these original goals have not been met, the effectiveness of the government’s laws regarding affirmative action has reached its pinnacle point, as these very groups for which it was implemented for have still yet to represent themselves equally across the board. The government has tried to amend the laws regarding affirmative action, but they are merely placing a band aid on a gaping wound. There are still sections of society which are suppressed still to this day, and therefor are underrepresented in our work places, all levels of education, and various levels of government agencies. Affirmative action has not been able to effectively change gears and represent the people in our society who are suppressed.
Just a few examples of groups of people that are underrepresented in the United States of America, as there are numerous other examples beyond our own borders, are listed below:
Women in politics, high levels of businesses, or the armed forces.
Homosexuals in politics, the armed forces, Chick-fil- a, or Hobby Lobby.
All religions are not represented in politics equally.
Affirmative action is a tough issue for me. You want to believe that any person, no matter where they come from or what their background, can succeed in this country, and in many cases that is true. But we do not live in an ideal society. It is hard for me to believe that, for example, an african-american man growing up in the deep south has as equal a chance to success as a white person in the north-east. It’s as much about class and poverty as it is about race. I do believe some people are born a few steps behind. At the same time, you have to wonder if some of the programs that our government creates set people up to fail and just perpetuate the cycles even though they are intended to do good.
I have similar feelings to this topic. I do want to believe that we are all across fair in every aspect in concerns to race, religion, color, national origin and gender. I believe that these laws are indispensable, in the aspect that they create a protection for us all; and reminder to employers who may still be discriminating at any level that it is indeed unlawful to victimize and can be punished for doing so.
Everyone of the government programs have good intentions, and many have benefited from them. However, it is up to the individual person, group, family to take advantage of the opportunities. That’s all the programs are for. To provide opportunities. The personalities that abuse it, has deeper issues that is very difficult to have an answer for.
Affirmitive action is no longer relevant in today’s world. People should no longer gain preferential treatment in the selection procss. It is unfair and unjust. Those who are still advocating affirmitive action are signaling themselves out as being different or needing special treatment. However, there is a way out. Many people can go to school for free, So there is no excuse for failure. Some people are born into a poverty situation. This fact should impower them to work hard and escape from it. This escape shouldn’t inturn discriminate against someone who is not considered a minority.
I believe that affirmitive action is no longer needed becuase in the present day most peolpe all have the same oppertunities as everyone else. It is also not needed becuase many women and minorities are in the workforce and is making their way up the work force ladder. I believe that if a company is stil practicing the affirmative action they are not being open to new ideas and they are dicriminating people.
I do not believe affirmative action is still necessary. Everybody should be allowed the same opportunity going on experience and knowledge not race, religion or gender. Everybody should be looked at as an equal and not judged upon for anything and given a chance. Hard workers should get what they earn and not be judged on anything.
I don’t think having your children in private schools will prove anything. I think it’s how the structure is in the home. You can struggle with money but still provide a good loving home for your child and do the best you can as a parent. There is so much out there to help low income families so they can have help for a better life. Sometimes these kids that are spoiled and handed over everything and put into private schools take it for granted and have problems. It’s all in how the child takes everything in on their actions. Both ways could be positive or both could go bad just depending on the person.
I absoluetly agree with you Desiree on the structure that the family provides the children. It is very similar to the culture that the organization estableshes. For example, if the organization has no culture, it may be chaotic. Likewise if the parents spoils its children, teaches them no value, then baically in most cases the parents are setting up their children to fail in life, unless the child is motivated and informed, and wants a better life growing up. He than can take advantage of all the education programs that are out there.
@ bayocum; In regards to affirmative action in the workforce i believe that the organization should hire the most qualified candidate. So i believe that affirmative action is not neccessary in the workforce. As an adult i belive that one may succeed in life if we are a well qualified employee. No from an eduacation perspective, i do believe that certain priveledges is necessary for students who would like to further their education. I think it is awesome if a child would like to further their education, and receive a better career than their parents. This is awesome. I believe it is every parents dreams to see their child become more successful than they were. The choices that the parents made early in life should not restrict the childs success in life. I believe that the government aid for special priveledges in disadvantage students is simply giving them an equal opportunity as to those wealthy children.